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Pathetic Roadcourse Racing - Your Thoughts?
Today was a great day for RGM, and Robby. He proved he still has the talent and car control to compete for wins at road courses.
That being said, today left a very sour taste in my mouth for what has become Nascar racing on road courses. I will be the first to admit I originally started as an open wheel fan, but have been watching Nascar since the early 1990's and even worked in the garage for a period of time. I have participated in a few non-sanctioned track days and time attack events, but that is the extent of my racing background. To me though, the way that the majority of drivers raced today was pathetic. Moving people out of the way, dive-bombing corners and taking people out, purposely turning a driver, etc. Like I said, I have been watching Nascar for almost two decades now and that was the most ridiculous event I have seen. The Nationwide race the day before was a good warm up though to the stupidity, as much of the same occured...
I remember when Carl Edwards hooked Brad Keselowski into the fence at Atlanta I was irate Nascar didn’t come down harder on Carl. Now I understand why Carl did what he did. Brad not only acted like a moronic pinball today, but pulled the same crap while up front at Road America.
Jeff Gordon should be ashamed of how he drove. He is a 4 time champion and has won many races, but you would be hard pressed to tell that today. This is the same whiney runt that complained when Robby moved him up the track at New Hampshire in 2001 for his first win. Pick any of the bump and runs Jeff did today, they all outrank Robby's move on the chicken-sh*t scale.
I could go on and on, but I will only bring up one last incident. Mattias Ekstrom ran an excellent race, and got taken out. The broadcasters tried to talk around it by claiming the Nascar regulars do not respect new guys, but after today can it be said they respect anyone? Mattias was running under what I would call proper road course etiquette, and got taken out. Watch Indy car races, FIA events, touring car races, etc. The Nascar race today resembled a video game more than a road course event.
That’s my view on it. I am sure some of you loved the beating and banging, but all I saw was poor driving and cheap moves. Just think back to 2001, when people made a big deal about Harvick riding Robby's ass trying to get his lap back. Jim Smith pled with Childress to get Harvick to back down, the announcers played it up; it was a big deal. Today, any given minute on the track was filled with actions that far outweighed that sequence of events.
Maybe its the fact these drivers no longer fear injury, maybe Nascar is coaching them to bump more, maybe the poorly designed COT prevents passing so much drivers need to move each other out of the way. Whatever the reason, it was sad to watch. I fear Robby will more than likely get caught up in a wreck at the Glen if this continues, its almost turning into a restrictor-plate-like crap shoot to finish well. Just ask Dale Junior, even he will laugh about his decent finish today and how it wasn’t really earned.
What are everyone else's opinions? Just curious, and I had to vent...
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by TOG on
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Yesterday was a very fun day. It think its safe to say we all just wanted there to be enough fuel, but give credit to the team. They knew exactly how much they were getting per fuel run, and had it figured out to perfection.
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Permalink Reply by racerx5091 on
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Marcos's blunder at the end of the race was the Bill Buckner mistake of the year. It will be interesting to see if he can recover from it.
But I'm getting tired of the nascar veterans essentially saying that you have to earn their respect for them to be treated fairly on the track. Whether this comes from being born with a golden spoon, having daddy pay for their equipment, coming from a non-oval race series, to being too young, etc., should have nothing to do with it. Each driver should be allotted enough respect that they can't be taken out purposely or dive bombed.
It's not road racing's fault. In fact, other than the super speedways, the road races are my favorite to watch. It's nascar's fault. I've amatuer raced before, and the sanctioning bodies do not stand for avoidable contact. They will bring you in, in a second, for a timed penalty. It's because nascar does not have this penalty that the road races have become a wreck fest. They need to penalize for avoidable contact.
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Permalink Reply by Sherri Fryer on
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It seems that the alternative to drivers having contact would be to have them drive around in single file . Who the hell wants to see that ? It's a race , and there will always be stupid moves made by any given driver at any given time .
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Permalink Reply by Matt on
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Or how about have drivers make good passes with superior car control and better setups, aka the fast guys will still get to the front.
Are other series that dont have this constant beating and banging on road courses not racing? Or are Nascar drivers just more stupid? Or are they driving this way because Nascar has painted them in a box with terrible cars, fuel mileage-based distances, and a call to have more contact to help gain back the increasingly smaller fan base?
Either way, these guys in my mind are better than the awful moves they were pulling yesterday. I guess thats my issue. Road course racing in Nascar has not always been like that.
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I get what you're saying , there were a lot of stupid moves yesterday , by drivers who one would think wouldn't make them . Jeff Gordon was driving like it was his first RC race . Since Nascar has made it pretty clear that this is what they want from the drivers , I don't see what , if anything can be done to change it .
As I see it there are no 'solutions' to the problems with Nascar , some fans are going to like what they see , others aren't . Can there ever be a middle ground where all fans are happy? I don't think so , but maybe I'm wrong .
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Permalink Reply by WJM on
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Matt, I understand what you're saying. In comparison to other racing series there's more beating and banging in NASCAR road races. However, as an example, comparing a 3,400 lb. Cup car to a ALMS GT1 at 2,750 lbs. or a GT2 at 2,519 lbs is comparing apples to oranges. GT class cars use 18 in. wheels .vs 15 in. for Cup cars allowing for much larger brakes and carbon fiber rotors and pads (GT1 only) .vs cast iron. Heavy cars and limited braking capabilities leads to dive bombing and encourages drivers into desperate (stupid) attempts in overtaking.
Last year Goodyear proposed and tested a 17 in. wheel with a low profile tire with the same tire height currently used. This would be a huge improvement for obvious reasons; primarily bigger brakes, but also the lower sidewalls would also prevent drivers from pounding off the to curbs. A smooth driving style would be rewarded. The bonzai drivers would spend their time in garage making repairs.
Given the glacial pace NASCAR moves to implement anything "modern" combined with their "not invented here" attitude, it will never happen. When was the last time you saw a a engine with a carburetor in a new car showroom?
My two schillings.
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I don't have a problem with rubbing fenders, but there was a lot of intentional dive bombing and spinning out yesterday. I love how the commentators make excuses for them. So phoney. I think all Nascar has to do is give a couple of the more obvious wreckers a penalty, and they'll all straighten up.
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Amen to that .
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Permalink Reply by Matt Gruber on
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And NASCAR has stood by 'have at it' by not lowering the boom on Edwards after he flipped the 12 in a clearly intentional move.
TOG, I know you said elsewhere that Truex would cool off this week -- and they usually do -- but let's see what happens if the 56 punts one of NASCAR's cash cows this week at N.H.
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He wont lay a bumper on them. The more a driver talks about doing something, the less they will.
I asked Jamie Mac at VIR about the 2008 Dover incident with RG, and how he said he was going to pay RG back. Jamie told me that he forgot about it a few days after the race. I just think Truex will forget about it.
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